Synthetic Gaming and ST20G5 IGP
While many will question the actual relevance of 3DMark03 scores in comparison to actual gaming performance, we do find the product to be very useful as a stress test of systems. If you can loop 3DMark03 for 24 hours without a crash on a system, we're generally willing to call the system 100% stable. We also use the program in looping mode as our stress test for checking system temperatures and noise levels. Since we had already run all of the systems with 3DMark03, we have included the results for reference.
The 3D portion of the score is biased heavily towards the graphics card, so it's not surprising to find that nearly all of the systems perform within 1% of each other - not counting the IGP of the Shuttle unit or the 330P. The CPU results are less dependent on the graphics card, but we still only get a 3% spread between the most of the systems - again, not counting the IGP score for the ST20G5 or the 330P. The Xpress 200 graphics of the ST20G5 are able to complete the benchmark, but just barely. As you'll see in our chart below, performance simply isn't adequate for some games.
3DMark03 was one of the applications that caused some stability problems for the 330P. Without having the System Control utility running, it simply would not complete at all. Even with the utility, the scores are quite a bit behind other units - 7% slower than the fastest in the 3D score, and a whopping 17% slower in the CPU test. Since this is more of a theoretical benchmark than a real game, we won't give it as much weight, but the fact remains that the CPU time used by the System Control utility as well as lower performance in general is a definite mark against the 330P.
ST20G5 IGP Results
We grouped all of the scores for the ST20G5 into one chart. Doom 3, even on the low detail setting, is completely unplayable. Disabling the shadows and bump mapping raised the scores to acceptable levels at 640x480, but the game simply isn't meant to be played that way in our opinion, so we're not reporting the results. The Xpress 200 graphics are slightly slower than an X300SE card, due to the use of system memory, and an X300SE is nothing special. Doom 3 clearly requires more memory bandwidth for its shadow calculations than what the RAM can provide. Half-Life 2 is a different story. It requires more pixel processing and CPU power and less bandwidth, enabling reasonably playable performance even at 1024x768. The City 17 level actually runs faster on the IGP than the Canals level, as the C17 level puts more strain on the CPU than the GPU. Low to mid 20 FPS scores aren't great, but you can live with them in a pinch.
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JarredWalton - Friday, August 12, 2005 - link
I'll hit the KLOSS as soon as I can. (I have it already.) So unless someone else votes, I guess I'll get the KLOSS reviewed next.Sokolum - Thursday, August 11, 2005 - link
For the last 2 months now i have a ST20G5 using as a MCE system. There are a few problems what i have encounbtered, one of them is that the system behaviour changes when i change a setting within the BIOS. Those aren't dramatic changes. But with every change, it looks like that the graphics runs muchmore slower, you can see this with dragging a windows screen over your desktop, you get trails from that window...The system only runs smooth when i *don't* touch those setting. Happily the things keep running smoothly when i enlarge the shared video memory.
For the MCE side, i failed to make the Hauppauge 500MCE run compleetly as it should, i am only able to run TV 'Tunner 1' without problems when i *disable* TV 'Tunner 2' within windows Device Manager. Shuttle or Hauppauge couldn't help me with this case.
As the review documented, this is one of the cases that RAID is causing the problem in this story. In my MCE setup, i don't use RAID (there is *no* room for a seccond drive when you installed a floppy drive). Why RAID is the problem, what i have been told is that RAID wants to use al of the PCI bandwith. It seems the nature of RAID in this kind of systems, just een told, i am not for 100% sure, but it seems plausible to mee.
, a nice looking machine. I solved the problem for the flash cards with buying a floppy disk what come with a integrated card readed, see link:
http://www.alternate.nl/html/shop/productDetails.h...">http://www.alternate.nl/html/shop/productDetails.h...
mino - Thursday, August 11, 2005 - link
Jared I must confes, this is the _first_ time i see everclocking test done as it should have been. I really appreciate the comments for newbies (it makes easier to me to explain to them if you could reference somthing :). Also finally use of correct term oo A64 base freq./FSB issue. I think this way is it should be done for _all_ A64 motherboard review.1) do a maximum base freq. check (by keeping memfreq. around DDR400 + CPU not overclocked
2) do a max memclock test at 1T (with some proven components, just to check quality of CPU to MEM routing on the MB)
3) do some max. overclock test (actually this may be optional since it depend mostly CPU chosen)
Keep at this route and many readers may finaly undestand the basics of A64's OCing.
JarredWalton - Thursday, August 11, 2005 - link
I'm working on some detailed overclocking articles right now. Glad you enjoyed the section, and I'll be going into a LOT more detail (with benchmarks) on some future OC articles.dropadrop - Thursday, August 11, 2005 - link
Thanks for the nice review,If you are considering a followup I would love to see you test usb. While the usb on my sn95g5 v2 works for casual things like a mouse, digital camera and memory card reader, it does not work for an ipod shuffle, external soundcard (hercules dj console), or external hardisk.
There have been alot of people with similar experiences. It wold be great if you could find a way to test the sff's with a few "demanding" usb devices, and even measure the voltage (and stability of it) supplied via usb.
I also second the request for you to test the sn95g5 with an X2. The new bios surely supports them, as people in north america have been getting their current rigs modded by shuttle for support. I would love to see how your's supports it (and maby even venice / san diego) without being modded. I believe you would have the chance to help alot of confused SN95G5 users by trying out a few cpu's in it.
JarredWalton - Thursday, August 11, 2005 - link
I will definitely give it a shot. At present, my intention is to purchase an external IDE HDD enclosure with USB2.0 and 1394A support and do some file transfers and such between that and the system. The problem with that approach is that the enclosures all have an external power source. Can anyone recommend an inexpensive USB/Firewire HDD enclosure that gets the power over the USB port? http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82...">I found this one, but I'm not really keen on spending $160 for something I don't personally need.dev0lution - Wednesday, August 10, 2005 - link
How come the SN25P details don't mention the update from nforce4 standard to nForce4 Ultra? I'm thinking of getting one so I went to the previous review and it lists chipset in the specs as the nForce 4 standard, but if you go to Shuttle's current product page for the SN25P it lists the chipset as the Nforce4 Ultra. Who's correct?JarredWalton - Thursday, August 11, 2005 - link
I think I may have just been lazy or neglectful in the original SN25P article. I'm pretty sure it was always nForce4 Ultra. Then again, regular nf4 vs. nF4U only adds SATA-II support IIRC. I don't see anything about SN25P supporting SATA-II which is sort of odd.Cookie Crusher - Wednesday, August 10, 2005 - link
I know it may be a "dated" or more "Entry Oriented" socket, but I have found that the socket 754 SFF systems are great for gaming and general use. Was there ever a roundup for them? If not, I'd like to see maybe a limited look at them to remind everyone that they are viable alternatives to, and about $75-$100+ cheaper than, these socket 939 options.I think it's important to point this out because of the note in the article that a SFF option incurs a premium....maybe so, but there are still cost effective options in that market. thanks.
Cookie Crusher - Wednesday, August 10, 2005 - link
Nevermind.....i found the roundup I was hoping for.....still, would be nice to make that reference to the older socket types as legitimate choices for SFF hopefuls on a budget. :-)