Conroe Buying Guide: Feeding the Monster
by Gary Key & Wesley Fink on July 19, 2006 6:20 AM EST- Posted in
- Motherboards
Biostar TForce P965 Deluxe
Basic Features
Biostar has delivered a basic but performance oriented P965 board that should sell for around US $135 or under. While our board and BIOS are from the first production run, we were surprised after dealing with our other P965 based boards at how stable and generally dialed in this board is right now. Although we certainly believe that future BIOS releases will extract additional performance from this board, it was nice to boot up this board and have it just plain work as advertised. This board did not require a BIOS of the day or week to work with various Conroe steppings or to address memory performance and stability issues.
The layout of the board is very nice with a double slot next to the PCIe X16 connector that allows the use of dual slot GPU cards without losing either a PCIe or PCI connector. We think Biostar provided the right combination of PCIe and PCI slots for today's market considerations. While the 24-pin ATX power connection is in an awkward position, Biostar stated this was the best possible location for stable power delivery, and we are seeing this location utilized more and more on other P965 and 975X boards now. The floppy drive connector is also located at the opposite end of the board and for those still using this type of drive it will create a cabling issue. Overall, we like the general layout and options on this board.
Basic Performance
The performance of the board was at times in the upper segment of our roundup and at others near the bottom when excluding the ASRock value board. We found the board to be a very consistent performer and extremely stable up to its limit. Unfortunately, we do not know what the true limit of this board will be until we see further BIOS optimizations and improvements in the memory voltages. As with recent Biostar boards in the new TForce series, we see significant BIOS options available for the performance oriented crowd yet they have once again let us down on memory voltages.
This board only supports up to 2.2V and only allows four total memory voltage choices. Without additional memory voltages up to 2.4V that we see in the majority of boards being released at this time, it was impossible to really push our memory and improve the overall performance of the board when overclocking. We once again contacted Biostar and chastised them for this omission. One could argue that a board in this market sector would probably not require higher memory voltages but a board being marketed for the performance user should include voltages up to 2.4V along with additional adjustments. The balance of the BIOS is obviously tailored for this type of user and unlike others we have tested this BIOS was stable and almost error free for a first release.
We still believe overall that this board is a great value at this time and offers what appears to be the best blend of performance and price in our roundup. While Gigabyte, Foxconn, ECS, Abit, and others have released or are in the process of releasing mainstream P965 boards, we congratulate Biostar for having a board of this quality available quickly.
Overclocking
We were quite surprised by our overclocking results on this board but we did have to gradually increase the FSB speeds and alter the memory settings in order to reach this level. While this is generally indicative of a board at its limits, we believe part of the hunt and search activities that were required are due to a BIOS designed for stability/compatibility first with hopefully the inevitable performance tuning coming in the next revision.
When we installed our X6800 and started testing for maximum FSB overclocking we were treated with a 9x379 result that indicates additional headroom is available on this board and hopefully the board will reward us with higher overclocks in the next BIOS revision, so we might find the true FSB ceiling on the board to be near 380.
Basic Features
| Biostar TForce P965 Deluxe | |
| Market Segment: | Mid-Range/Performance |
| CPU Interface: | Socket T (Socket 775) |
| CPU Support: | LGA775-based Pentium 4, Celeron D, Pentium D, Core 2 Duo |
| Chipset: | Intel P965 + ICH8R |
| Bus Speeds: | 266 to 500 in 1MHz Increments |
| Memory Speeds: | Auto, 533, 667, 800 |
| PCIe Speeds: | Auto, CPU, Fixed at 100MHz, 100MHz~200MHz |
| PCI: | Fixed at 33 |
| Dynamic Tuning: | V6 Tech - 10%~15% V8 Tech - 15%~25% V12 Tech - 25%~30% |
| Core Voltage: | Startup, 1.10000V to 1.80000V in 0.00625V increments |
| CPU Clock Multiplier: | Auto, 6x-11x in 1X increments if CPU is unlocked |
| DRAM Voltage: | 1.8V, 2.0V, 2.1V, 2.2V |
| DRAM Timing Control: | SPD, 8 Options |
| FSB Termination Voltage: | Auto, 1.2V, 1.3V, 1.4V, 1.5V |
| NB/SB Voltage: | Auto,1.5V, 1.6V, 1.7V, 1.8V |
| Memory Slots: | Four 240-pin DDR2 DIMM Slots Dual-Channel Configuration Regular Unbuffered Memory to 8GB Total |
| Expansion Slots: | 1 - PCIe X16 1 - PCIe X4 1 - PCIe X1 3 - PCI Slots 2.3 |
| Onboard SATA/RAID: | 6 SATA 3Gbps Ports - Intel ICH8R (RAID 0,1,1+0,5,JBOD) |
| Onboard IDE: | 1 Standard ATA133/100/66/33 Port (2 drives) VIA VT6410 |
| Onboard USB 2.0/IEEE-1394: | 10 USB 2.0 Ports - 6 I/O Panel 4 Headers No Firewire Support |
| Onboard LAN: | Gigabit Ethernet Controller Realtek RTL 8110SC |
| Onboard Audio: | Realtek ALC883 HD-Audio 8-channel CODEC |
| Power Connectors: | ATX 24-pin, 4-pin EATX 12V |
| I/O Panel: | 1 x Serial 1 x PS/2 Keyboard 1 x PS/2 Mouse 1 x RJ45 6 x USB 2.0/1.1 8-Channel Audio I/O |
| BIOS Revision: | AWARD ip96a614 |
Biostar has delivered a basic but performance oriented P965 board that should sell for around US $135 or under. While our board and BIOS are from the first production run, we were surprised after dealing with our other P965 based boards at how stable and generally dialed in this board is right now. Although we certainly believe that future BIOS releases will extract additional performance from this board, it was nice to boot up this board and have it just plain work as advertised. This board did not require a BIOS of the day or week to work with various Conroe steppings or to address memory performance and stability issues.
 |
| Click to enlarge |
The layout of the board is very nice with a double slot next to the PCIe X16 connector that allows the use of dual slot GPU cards without losing either a PCIe or PCI connector. We think Biostar provided the right combination of PCIe and PCI slots for today's market considerations. While the 24-pin ATX power connection is in an awkward position, Biostar stated this was the best possible location for stable power delivery, and we are seeing this location utilized more and more on other P965 and 975X boards now. The floppy drive connector is also located at the opposite end of the board and for those still using this type of drive it will create a cabling issue. Overall, we like the general layout and options on this board.
Basic Performance
The performance of the board was at times in the upper segment of our roundup and at others near the bottom when excluding the ASRock value board. We found the board to be a very consistent performer and extremely stable up to its limit. Unfortunately, we do not know what the true limit of this board will be until we see further BIOS optimizations and improvements in the memory voltages. As with recent Biostar boards in the new TForce series, we see significant BIOS options available for the performance oriented crowd yet they have once again let us down on memory voltages.
This board only supports up to 2.2V and only allows four total memory voltage choices. Without additional memory voltages up to 2.4V that we see in the majority of boards being released at this time, it was impossible to really push our memory and improve the overall performance of the board when overclocking. We once again contacted Biostar and chastised them for this omission. One could argue that a board in this market sector would probably not require higher memory voltages but a board being marketed for the performance user should include voltages up to 2.4V along with additional adjustments. The balance of the BIOS is obviously tailored for this type of user and unlike others we have tested this BIOS was stable and almost error free for a first release.
We still believe overall that this board is a great value at this time and offers what appears to be the best blend of performance and price in our roundup. While Gigabyte, Foxconn, ECS, Abit, and others have released or are in the process of releasing mainstream P965 boards, we congratulate Biostar for having a board of this quality available quickly.
Overclocking
| Biostar TForce P965 Deluxe Overclocking Testbed |
|
| Processor: | Intel Core 2 Duo E6700 Dual Core, 2.67GHz, 4MB Unified Cache 1066FSB, 10x Multiplier |
| CPU Voltage: | 1.525V (default 1.2V) |
| Cooling: | Tuniq Tower 120 Air Cooling |
| Power Supply: | OCZ GameXStream 700W |
| Memory: | Corsair Twin2X2048-PC2-8500C5 (2x1GB) (Micron Memory Chips) |
| Hard Drive | Hitachi 250GB 7200RPM SATA2 16MB Cache |
| Maximum OC: (Standard Ratio) |
364x10 (3-3-3-9) 3640MHz (+36%) |
We were quite surprised by our overclocking results on this board but we did have to gradually increase the FSB speeds and alter the memory settings in order to reach this level. While this is generally indicative of a board at its limits, we believe part of the hunt and search activities that were required are due to a BIOS designed for stability/compatibility first with hopefully the inevitable performance tuning coming in the next revision.
When we installed our X6800 and started testing for maximum FSB overclocking we were treated with a 9x379 result that indicates additional headroom is available on this board and hopefully the board will reward us with higher overclocks in the next BIOS revision, so we might find the true FSB ceiling on the board to be near 380.
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Vidmar - Wednesday, July 19, 2006 - link
One thing that really bugs me about some of the MB manufactures is that some never state the exact number of PCIe lanes that are actually available on that second PCIe 16x slot. Some do some don’t. Some state it while in SLI/Crossfire mode but not when in non- SLI/Crossfire mode.Right now I’ve got an nForce 4 SLI board that has two PCIe 16x slots, but when in non-SLI mode they are at 16x and 2x respectively. When in SLI mode they are both at 8x respectively.
The problem with this is that (at least on this board) you cannot install anything but a video card in the second PCIe 16x slot when in SLI mode.
I’ve got an PCIe 8x SCSI raid card (LSI 320-2e) that I’m trying to use in the second PCIe slot at 8x, but this board won’t even acknowledge that its there while in SLI mode. And when running in non-SLI it only runs at 2x and becomes a bottleneck for this workstation.
So if its possible to provide some details as to what exactly a board can do on the second PCIe 16x slot in both normal and SLI/Crossfire mode, that would be most helpful!
For example on the ASUS P5W-DH Deluxe in your review it doesn’t state this information either way. But on the Intel 975XBX you do have that information.
So what does the second PCIe slot run at in non-Crossfire mode on the ASUS P5W-DH Deluxe?
Also do you happen to have a SCSI PCIe card you can test in the second slot (or any PCIe card for that matter) and see if the BIOS can recognize the card while in SLI/Crossfire mode? That too would be helpful for people who don’t care about multiple GPUs, but want to create large array workstations.
Thanks!
PS: nice article.
supremelaw - Thursday, July 20, 2006 - link
Excellent points! Constant change is here to stay :)On our ASUS P5WD2 Premium with i955X chipset,
we are now faced with that very same problem:
we don't need 2 video cards, because we do
mostly database development. And, we want
to dedicate the second "universal" x16 slot
to a high-performance PCI-E RAID controller.
(Santa Claus is going to bring me an x1900
PCI-E video card anyway, and that should
easily last me for another 20 years, min!)
Our consultant highly recommends the Areca model,
but it only performs best in x8 mode. On the
other hand, our ASUS User Manual states that
the second "universal" x16 slot can only run
in x4 mode, maximum.
That limitation was a single line of text
in that User Manual, but it is not mentioned
in any of the other specs for our motherboard.
His recommendation: switch to a server motherboard,
so we can use the Areca RAID 6 controller (not a bad
idea, actually).
So, I think we'll have to settle for the Promise
PCI-E model EX8350, which is also limited to x4 mode,
but it now supports RAID 6 too.
It only took about 4 hours of research to confirm
this limitation, however :)
Such specs should be better documented, for sure!
Sincerely yours,
/s/ Paul Andrew Mitchell
Webmaster, Supreme Law Library
http://www.supremelaw.org/">http://www.supremelaw.org/
Missing Ghost - Wednesday, July 19, 2006 - link
I find it weird that the pcie card does not work in 8x mode. I see no reason why it wouldn't work...the sli pcb that you flip around only redirects the lanes AFAIK.vhx - Wednesday, July 19, 2006 - link
Too bad the motherboards cost more than a decent Conroe processor. Kind of sad to see the features lacking until you get into the $250 price ranges. You can spot an AMD AM2 motherboard with the same features for around $130ish, which makes this 975X chipset rediculously expensive compared to the newer AM2's. The TForce P965 looks like a great alternative for the price, although based on the 965P. Hmm upgrading to Conroe will be more expensive than I thought.... /sigh. What to do.Gary Key - Wednesday, July 19, 2006 - link
Wait, that is right, wait until the motherboard suppliers are in full production in August. There will be a large variety of motherboards available by the end of August that will make up the $50~$150 range with chipsets from the 945P to nF570SLI being sold. We will also start seeing the G965 boards in late August for those that want a mATX form factor, decent graphics,and the ability to upgrade later. If you need a board now, it will cost you. ;-)
JarredWalton - Wednesday, July 19, 2006 - link
Not to mention getting the Core 2 CPUs. :) I would expect prices to drop significantly within a month or so.
jonp - Saturday, July 22, 2006 - link
Jarred,Please say more about your comment on pricing.
http://www.dailytech.com/article.aspx?newsid=3377">http://www.dailytech.com/article.aspx?newsid=3377
says:
Thanks, Jon
multiblitz2 - Wednesday, July 19, 2006 - link
I was waiting for the 965 as HDMI/HDCP-support is a must have for my new HTPC. Does 975 support this in the same way as the 965 ?araczynski - Wednesday, July 19, 2006 - link
great article!looking forward to additional mobo's appearing (and more importantly - prices dropping) beforei build my next rig.
i personally refuse to pay over $150 for ANY mobo, no matter the features. but i do realize that the initial price gouging is to milk the early adopters. i figure by early october prices should be just right for all the nice toys.
araczynski - Wednesday, July 19, 2006 - link
i know this is a dead horse, by why in the world can't these manufacturers make models that throw out some of these legacy 'extras' they keep putting on the boards?onboard sound, parallel ports, floppy connectors, etc...